Artist John Baldessari is notorious for, at some point, burning all his paintings. This act enabled him to become a major figure in the development of conceptual art, an art form equally derided and applauded, but close to the idea of art as research of personal experience.

This is what he had to say about it.

“Doing art is the only thing I’ve come across that’s gives me any idea that I’m anywhere close to understanding what the universe is about. It all sounds very mystical I know, but I think that’s what drives me.

The real truth in the universe is there’s movement and change and art reflects that, and dance, you know, any anything with movement or music or whatever. But, you know, in painting or sculpture it’s just all static. I guess around certain objects or certain situations there are certain conventional parameters, and we can begin to use those meanings like a writer you know, like a musician, or like a cook, whatever and create some sort of composition or dish.

I think was around ‘68 thereabouts, close enough, I was getting doubtful that painting equals art and art equals painting. I began to suspect that art might be more than that. I was literally thinking of my work as a surrogate for me, and me talk about a body of work, and so I took it very, very literally and thought of it, you know, this body had to be cremated. The ashes I still have, they were given to me in these sort of like shoe box’s, but not quite as big, and that would be the size for the ashes of an adult.

So I got nine boxes of those and then one smaller box which was used for babies and amputated limbs. They asked me if I wanted an urn for the ashes, and I hadn’t thought about it prior, and I said well let me see what you got. The one I chose was in the shape of a book. I like that you know, that I could have it on my shelf. And I did actually make some cookies out of them at one point.

Only one person and I knew ever ate one and the idea there was that there be some sort of eternal return you know, that pigment comes out of the earth and it comes back you know, and is made in the paintings and the painting is burned and goes back into the Earth again by shitting it out and, and so painting is just one point on the circle. I was truly sick. It was just like a whole new world opening up. I didn’t know what it was but it wasn’t going to be painting….”

Watch the video below.

The transcript ends at about 3:30